The Ambitious Bookkeeper Podcast

183 ⎸ Keys to Growth & Pricing with Ryan Lazanis

• Serena Shoup, CPA • Episode 183

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In this interview episode, I chat with Ryan Lazanis from FutureFirm about growth strategies and pricing tips to help streamline your firm. Whether you're just getting started or looking to scale, Ryan shares some golden nuggets on navigating the world of accounting business with ease and purpose.

In this episode you’ll hear:

  • Ryan’s journey from starting Zen Accounting to selling it and then launching FutureFirm
  • cool ways to get clients
  • how to communicate pricing increases without annoying your clients
  • tips on content creation
  • the importance of having a community to bounce ideas off


Resources mentioned in this episode:


Meet Ryan

Ryan Lazanis, CPA founded Xen Accounting, a 100% cloud-based accounting firm, in 2013. Following its acquisition in 2018, Ryan started Future Firm which provides coaching, community and training to help accountants quickly scale a systematic firm of their own that improves their lifestyle. Ryan currently educates close to 10,000 firm leaders globally via his free weekly newsletter and coaches hundreds of successful accounting firms through his Future Firm Accelerate online coaching program.


Connect with Ryan

💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryanlazanis/

🗞️ Newsletter: https://futurefirm.co/newsletter/


Thanks for listening. If this episode inspired you in some way, take a screenshot of you listening on your device and post it to your Instagram stories and tag me, @ambitiousbookkeeper

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Welcome back to the Ambitious Bookkeeper podcast. Today I have another special guest. Every guest is super special and I know I say that every time I bring someone on but today I have Ryan Lizanis on with me to I'm not really sure where the conversation is going to go, but welcome Ryan. So nice to have you. Thank you very much, Serena. Really, uh, really nice to be here. Did it's kind of a full, for me, it's a full circle moment. Because when I first started the Ambitious Bookkeeper, I was in Amy Porterfield's List Builder Society. And I know you were in that group. I don't know if you were part of List Builder Society or DCA, but I remember seeing you in the group talking about accounting stuff too. And I was like, Oh my gosh. And then I just watched your, your brand like explode over the years too. And so it's kind of, for me, I'm like, this is a like fangirl moment. we ever talk about that? I don't know. Okay. Cause don't know if I talked about it at XeroCon when we chatted or not, but I don't know if we did, but maybe we did, but I mean , yeah, I mean, that was like the first online course I ever bought. And, um, I don't know how helpful it was in hindsight, but I think it helped me get started, I guess. But but yeah, now you're bringing back memories. So thanks for that. yeah. I, I agree with the, sometimes, and this is probably completely off topic of where I thought this podcast was going to go, but the thing you just mentioned about it. it helping get you started. Sometimes like it's okay to quote unquote invest in something and not use the entire thing. And as long as it gives you, it helps you stop spinning your wheels and gives you the motivation to start what you want to start, then it was a win, right? yeah, absolutely. I mean, and I think that's what we're trying to help with at the same time as well as stop reinventing the wheel. And I think like we have so many good resources at our hands right now but yeah, I mean, that, that was a good resource at the time that helped me get started, that helped me in the world of online marketing, specifically email marketing. And, you know, email marketing is, you Our biggest channel today, so yeah, it was a good, it was a good kickstart. It's Yeah, absolutely. And I want to mention for anyone listening Ryan still is sending out, is it still weekly emails or bi weekly? every Tuesday, 7. 40 a. m. Eastern Time. Very, very, very rare that I, I think I skipped one over the holidays, but other than that, I can probably count on one hand how many I've skipped since I started my newsletter, you know, over five years ago now. Yeah. So consistency. Very good. That's how I feel about my podcast. And honestly, I was like that with emails initially as well. I still do weekly emails, but now more of my energy is focused on the podcasts and the email is more just like driving people back here. So yeah, having that whatever channel you choose and being consistent, it doesn't feel really good to be able to say that. I think it's the most important, one of the most important things in digital marketing today is like if you're going to get involved, you need to be consistent and it needs to be consistently good, you know. So whether it's you doing your podcast, me doing my newsletter, there's people like Jason Stats who's pumping out like five YouTube videos a week, you know. you need to be, there's got to be some kind of volume involved and it's got to be quality. So it's not, it's not an easy game these days. Sure, so let's, we kind of just dove right into conversation. Let's backtrack for anyone who doesn't know who you are. I would be very surprised if any of my listeners don't know who you are, but in case, can you please just give us a little background on who you are, what you do, how you help people in our industry? so Ryan Lozanis I'm a CPA, born and raised in Montreal, Canada. I started an accounting firm over 10 years ago called Zen Accounting. It was one of the earliest online firms in North America when I started it. And it was really geared towards you know, making things easy for, you know, The, the, the firm owner and the clients involved. So just really making accounting easy and pain free. I had so many great ideas to launch that firm. The problem is I had no clue how to execute because I was very inexperienced and I didn't know anything about anything. I didn't know how to price. I didn't know how to sell. I didn't know how to market. I had zero clients. I had never hired or managed anyone in my life before. And you know, the first few years, were rife with problems and making tons of mistakes and you know, exceptionally stressful, you know, nights, sleepless nights, you know, I just didn't know what I was doing. ultimately I, I figured out the system to scale it and I took it from scratch to acquisition. It was acquired by a corporate services firm based out of the Isle of Man So I had to fly there, sign the deal, which was a cool experience. and then immediately I started FutureFirm after that. Even before I went through the acquisition, I knew what I wanted to do next. So I started FutureFirm to be the resource I wish I always had when I was running my firm so that I didn't have to make all these mistakes so that I had a blueprint so that I had support to lean on in the community. FutureFirm really just started as a blog, just kind of journaling my thoughts and my experience about running a firm and what I would maybe do different and giving free tips and tricks out. That morphed into a newsletter that has over 10, 000 readers on it currently. you know, I have a podcast about four years ago launched the FutureFirm Accelerate online coaching program, which is basically the system to scale a firm, systematize it take your, take your life back supported by self paced training, supported by live coaching when people need more help, and supported by community. We're over 800 active members in the community at the moment from all around the world. It's one of the things I enjoy the most is just connecting with firms, not just in U. S., not just in Canada where I'm from. from. all corners of the earth, Australia, New Zealand, uh, Japan, uh, you know, Middle East, everywhere in the world. So I think that's super cool. uh, and outside of work I'm a triathlete, or at least I try to be, I have one four year old daughter and, uh, I'm a husband. Awesome. I did not know about the triathlete thing which is interesting because I do read your newsletter, but I don't know if you've mentioned that in I don't talk about it that often, but it might come up from time to time, maybe on social media. But yeah, I don't talk about it super often. But yeah, it's what I've been doing for the last three years. It's basically a full time hobby. Let's call it. Yeah. Yeah. So starting, exiting your firm and starting Future Firm was like, it gave you the ability to pursue this full time hobby you have and also a family, because it sounds like I think you had your daughter. Um, closer to the beginning of a future firm, right? Yes. So I started a future firm over a little over five years ago. And I had a very good firm before, you know, so the, it wasn't like, There's a lot of things I could have done better, but it was a great business and it was a very difficult decision to sell the business. But I, but I also kind of understood what my purpose was and I believe I better connected with what FutureFirm was going to be doing. And I wanted to create FutureFirm from the ground up around the concept of freedom and flexibility. With my wife being Indonesian, her family in Indonesia, us visiting every so often, not to mention we have. Horrible winters here in Montreal. We like to, we like to go away for extended periods of time to that side of the world. So I really wanted something that wouldn't tie me down and Also, we were thinking about having a kid as well at the time. So I just needed absolute freedom and flexibility. And that's what Future Firm was built from the ground up around that concept. Yeah. Was that desire part of the reason for exiting your firm? Or were you approached and you're like, Oh, I never thought of doing this. Like, how did that go? Yeah, I never thought about selling. My father owned a business you know, for decades from, When I was a kid to when he retired and I just thought I would kind of follow in those footsteps. You know, my uncle, same thing, my other uncle, same thing. So I never had it in mind to, to, to switch. It was just when I started getting approached with different opportunities from different firms that wanted to acquire that kind of expertise because I was pretty early in the cloud accounting game. A lot of firms wanted to jump on board. So, you know, I had like, The mid sized firms. I had very large firms. I had the big four. There was firms in other parts of the world, like in France, the one that acquired me in the Isle of Man. You know, so they wanted that kind of, like, technology expertise to kind of offer that from a broader standpoint amongst their client base as well. So, yeah, it was never really a, um, a thought in my mind until I started getting approached. It was a very difficult time because like I said, the business was good. The business was growing. I didn't know what I wanted to do. So it was, uh, one of the toughest decisions I had to make. Yeah. So, And I can't do what you're doing. You're, you know, you do, you have a firm and you have, you're also helping professionals out and I have a one track mind, so that's just how I operate. yeah, it is, it is challenging at times and because of the split focus. My firm has not grown as fast as I want, but that's okay. Like it's, for me, it's about the freedom and flexibility as well. And being able to help other people. So it's like, it's not as big as I want it to grow yet. I know it can get there. It's just happening slower than, you know, other people who have the single focus. Right. And that's totally fine. So you did say that your firm was growing. So. If we can tie in that conversation to people listening, I know that's always a big question of like, well, how do you You know, how did you get your firm to grow? What do you think was one of the keys to maintaining, I'm assuming you maintained growth throughout the years that you were in business, but correct me if I would say a big portion of it was luck, uh, because it was a right time, right place kind of thing. When I started Zen accounting. Nobody was meeting people online like that when it comes to their accountants. Nobody was using these cloud accounting tools. QuickBooks Online wasn't even a thing. Like, it was the old QuickBooks Online before this new interface. Like, it wasn't even a thing. Um, people were scared about using, you know, these online tools for their accounting because they were worried that Well, my information's in the cloud. So there's like an education process involved to like just getting them comfortable using it. But there was a certain segment of the market that, that we're craving it. You know, the younger business owner, the more tech type entrepreneurs. And I went to a lot of those tech events in the early days, tech startup events. Develop the reputation there and client acquisition actually was one of the easiest easier things for my firm because nobody else was doing this So it was just about getting the word out So going to networking meetings was one thing and then I just tried a whole bunch of random strategies where 90 percent of them failed miserably But then landed on like guest blogging on these tech blogs and, like started to get some people started to comment and like, and get in touch based on that. And then I just said, okay, this is the only thing that's really working. So let me just blog. And that's how I started learning about blogging. And I really didn't have a sophisticated strategy because most firms weren't doing it. I was able to cut through the noise and that's how we got most of our clients just passively through Google through search engine optimization. And still today, blogging and SEO is an important strategy for us, but it's a lot more sophisticated and a lot more challenging as well. So for anyone that's like wanting to get into that, you better like writing and you better educate yourself on how to like be visible on Google through SEO. Okay, I, fun fact, just got a lead in Well, it came in a couple of days ago, but she, I had the call with her yesterday and I always ask on that interest form, how they find, how they found us. Like for anyone listening, missed opportunity if you're not asking that question when you're capturing leads. and, She said Google. And so when I got on the phone with her, I was like, so what, how did you find me on Google? Always an opportunity to learn. Apparently my SEO is working. Um, but yeah, it's, it's interesting because that is a long game for sure. Yes, it's a very long game and it's, it's tough. It's really tough today. Yeah, and I, I feel slightly lucky that I have, that I rank for that specific thing that I rank for, but I'm not complaining. So I just need to amp that up. But what you said a minute ago is that, like, right, right time, right place. So I also heard you say that, like, you were going to events where. The people that craved what you were offering were going to be at. And I still, even though that situation of cloud accounting being like cutting edge, that is, long gone. Now, doesn't it mean for our listener that they can't also be like doing the same thing. Like there's events for every niche and I still feel strongly that that's one of the best ways to reach your clients. What about you? I think it's one of the most recommended things. I don't like it. Yeah, none of us really do. I don't do it, but I did it in the early days when I needed to grind a bit. And you know, if you have no marketing in place right now and you need to pick up clients, then there's nothing more effective than just going out once a week and meeting people. And that's what I recommend as well like starting on social media sure go for it But you're only gonna see results three to six months later at minimum. You know, so you have to build an audience that's what it's about is you have to get people to know you you have to build an audience and If you're starting from scratch with digital marketing building that audience online takes a lot of time But you can do it almost instantly Just by going out to events and introducing yourself. And I know, I know that it's not what a lot of people enjoy doing or are comfortable doing. I might appear very extroverted, but I could assure you I'm actually very shy and introverted as well. So I know what it feels like. But it's something that we just have to, we have to do if we need to get some clients through the door. Yeah, absolutely. I totally resonate with all of that. It's, it's not something that is fun. By any means for a lot of us introverts but get a buddy to go with you, get someone that's like a hype person. That's going to be like, you need to meet my friend. She's a bookkeeper. It's not a bad idea. There's ways around it. So so yeah, the, the note about social media too, I I was just, as you were talking about that, I was thinking back to like, how did I build the audience that I have for ambitious bookkeeper? Cause I don't have that level of audience for my firm. But it real, and when I was thinking through that, as you were talking, I was like, well, even doing stuff online, it's the same amount of effort or more as going to an event because I'm doing that same, I'm having those same conversations I would have in an event. Right. in Facebook groups to get people on my list. That's how this started. but um, you can invest your time in either place, but it's going to be time probably I totally agree with you. All of this is a grind. You know, the marketing aspect of things today, the bar is very high. It's very easy to put content. It's very easy to meet people. So how do you actually stand out? That's I think one thing that like, has worked for me is what's driven me is like the purpose, you know, and the passion that I have for, you know, when I was running my firm, I was I was very frustrated with the typical accounting firm business model. I felt that provided a very bad experience to clients. I wanted to make things easy and pain free. So I was driven by that purpose. And with you know, future firm, you know, I, you know, again, I'm, frustrated with the accounting profession and the lack of innovation and the lack of. You know, the fact that most firms are stuck in this archaic business model that doesn't serve anyone well at all. And that's why Future Firm, that's why I started it because I wanted to help others escape from that. And, you know I think the concept of like freedom and flexibility we were discussing before Serena is very important to us and that's what I want to help others with. And I'm sure that's what you as well want to help others with. So that's what really, what drives me. It's not like. You know, the financial aspect. That's like one of the last things I'm thinking about. And I don't know really where I was going with that truthfully. Uh, I standing out. yeah, yeah. Standing out. I, you know, that, that, I think that passion and that purpose comes through maybe in what we do and people connect with that. Absolutely. Absolutely. So if you are, if your choice for marketing is to create social media content, you have to find a way for that to to come through just as you would if you're meeting with people in person. So that's going to be the starting point of standing out is figuring out what your purpose is and your passion. And then just talk about that over and over and over again, embody it, demonstrate it. Consistency, it gets to be boring, but that's how you get results. You are right on that one. Yeah, it's funny because there's time. I mean, everyone goes through this phase. I'm sure you have hit this wall multiple times just as I have of just being like, I'm really bored of talking about this thing, but then something will happen. where like my passion for it gets reignited. And then it's like, I have something slightly new to talk about around the same topics and like a slightly new spin because something different happened. So just hang in there if you get to that point. But yeah. So, we ended up connecting. For a very short moment at XeroCon, I think I intended on circling back and finding you again. Didn't end up happening, but I, I believe we were having a conversation around podcasting. And, your podcast has been one that I've been listening to for pretty much since you launched it, I think. And so can you let the listener know what's your podcast so they can find it as well? sure. So yeah, it's the future from accounting podcast and it started out with one hour interviews. And, I personally did not enjoy the format. Uh, I didn't like leading that kind of format. and I thought about just totally discontinuing the podcast altogether. then I, um, I was trying to find like different podcast formats out there or something that would. I'm always trying to think about it a little bit of a different angle, I guess, to kind of stick out and, so I was really into like blogging and SEO at the time and I was following Neil Patel, who's like a guru and search engine optimization. And like, I learned that like he had. a daily podcast that was only five minutes long. And I was like, wow, that sounds like, like, and he's just talking about like one specific actionable thing that you can do right now or one specific lesson for his audience. And I thought that was an interesting concept and I adopted that. So basically each episode is like five or six minutes long. It's a weekly episode and it's just on one specific thing. It's like in, it's out. It's just me on the podcast and it's meant to be like as actionable as possible. So listeners could listen and get like one tip to implement in their business. So that's the format that I've been doing. It's, you know, we're going on, uh, 200 episodes at this point. So so yeah, uh, that, that's, that's a little bit about the podcast. Yeah, I love that about the podcast and I like doing episodes like that are shorter too. And this is Giving me more permission to shorten them even more when I have to, but that's the, when I do solo episodes they end up like 10 or 15 minutes and sometimes I'm like, is that long enough? Do people, are they even gonna, but if there's enough of an action item in there. and really like straight to the, I, I really appreciate straight to the point. That's part of why I love your emails too. Those are very straight to the point as well. We have lots going on in our inbox and our ears, like we don't need, and here I am on like spread, like drawing out a hour long conversation probably, mean, it depends. them. It depends where people are consuming this, right? Some people will be consuming it in transit somewhere and a six minute episode is not going to cut it, you know? so we need these different formats. I think my whole, the way that I'm trying to deliver content We're, we're both dealing with very busy people, and how could I write something in as little words as possible? How can I get the point across as quickly as possible? my newsletter is a twice weekly email. There's a Tuesday email that goes out, which is like a curate. Here's the top five things you should know about in the industry that would be helpful for you. The Sunday email is like, I want to keep that to a hundred to 150 words. So it's just like, here's just like a template or here's just like something that you can implement right now, like cut out all the fluff possible. So I guess that, that's what I'm trying to achieve with the content. Yeah, and you're doing a great job of it as well. Yeah, those template, those template emails are really cool. So how do you come up with, how do you come up with all these ideas and constantly be able to, because I know someone's probably wondering, like, I would love to be able to do something like that to, to market, but like, I'm afraid I won't have the content. Uh sometimes I'll just go on LinkedIn. It's like, what do you guys want me to talk about? Like, tell me please. but I think it's. Tuning into those that you're speaking with in the community, right? So maybe I'll see someone ask a question on LinkedIn. Maybe I'll see like in our forums, someone continuously asked the same, like people are continuously asking the same types of questions. huh. Uh huh. Maybe there's something happening in the industry. That, you know, people might want to hear an opinion on, like what's happening in the world of bench, right? So everyone's kind of talked about that at this point, but that's just an example. So I guess it's just tuning in trying to stay as tuned in as possible. I'm subscribed to a ton of like newsletters that give me different ideas as well, related to accounting and bookkeeping, but also unrelated to that. i'm just trying to Be like a sponge and, and absorb what people are talking about. And yeah, I'm constantly just trying to think about ideas about what people would be interested in hearing about. Yeah. Thank you for doing that work. I appreciate that. Thank you. Because, I, as much as I would love to be able to offer, like, here's top five things you should know about in the industry. I don't have the desire to subscribe to everything to know what's going on. I try to stay as up to date as I can, but sometimes it's just a lot of noise. So good job cutting through the noise it does create a lot of noise. Thank you for reminding me. yeah, one day I'll be very happy to unsubscribe to all those newsletters. but yeah, so that's, the name of the game for me at this point. so we talked about growth and marketing and all that kind of stuff. And, the other thing that I know is always a good topic to discuss and And the last one that I want to give people ideas on is pricing and you actually just released an episode on this recently on raising prices and I really loved what you said when you're raising prices, not using the, I guess, excuse of like our costs have gone up or we're spending more time. So can you elaborate on that in case our listeners haven't heard that episode? Uh, so I think we think about ourselves too much. We don't think about our customer or our clients enough. So, you know, pricing is a topic near and dear to my heart. I think it's the biggest lever you can pull in your business to give yourself more freedom and flexibility for a variety of reasons. I think so many accounting professionals or bookkeeping professionals are getting it so incredibly wrong, and it's causing them to be stretched too thin, doing too much for too little you know, if you just understand certain strategies or tactics or frameworks about how to properly charge, you need less clients to earn the same kind of amount of money for the same amount of work. I put a lot of emphasis on that. you know, going through a price increase strategy amongst existing clients You know, we all have clients that have been with us for a while and they might have been on a price point that maybe made sense years ago, maybe not, and we never, we just left it in place and it no longer makes sense. So there, you know, a lot of times people are maybe applying, you know, the 5 percent increase, you know, inflation, maybe it's a 10 percent increase because we say we have higher costs. That's not a good justification for the clients. That's just going to frustrate the client. Anytime you get some kind of communication from any supplier out there that says, Our costs have gone up, we've made changes to our infrastructure or systems and because of that now we pass that cost on to you and that's why you have to pay more. That's a terrible, terrible justification that's going to just aggravate people. So if we are going to increase price without providing any additional value or any additional services, And literally, they're getting the exact same thing for more expensive. We need to, we need to frame that communication better. And we need to think about Maybe we're not providing an additional service, but maybe there has been additional value that they've received over the years with us because we've improved. We're not the firm that we were two or three years ago. We might have implemented some cyber security practices that now better protect our clients data. We might have implemented this new app or piece of technology that streamlines the process and eliminates friction. We might have moved from them having to Come to the office to sign papers and now making their life easier with e signatures. We might have hired a new tax manager or a new senior resource on the team that they get to now tap into. These are not additional services that you're providing, but it's additional layers of value. And that's what we need to come. That's what we need to tell them is your price is going to be increasing by X percent. And it's as a result of these improvements that we've been making over the years that benefit you in this way. If you frame it like that, they're much more likely to accept that kind of communication compared to saying, Our cost of increase, you know, inflation, this is why it costs is going to cost more for you. That doesn't jive well with them. So we have to think about the client or the customer first and frame everything in light of them. Whenever we want the client to do something, we have to think about why does it make sense for them. Right, like if we want them to move to this client portal, then, you know, they're going to have to log in, they're going to have to do this new workflow, this new process, like I'm just giving a random example here. We have to say, okay, this is how it's going to benefit you. This is why you have to do it. So anytime we want them to do something, we have to frame it in light of the benefit to them. Yeah, there's also some like language patterns that happen like the old example of Telling them our costs have gone up. So now it costs more to service you It's like that just that word cost is like it's got like this negativity around it. That's like Like there's very subtle things and just the language that you use with people that can really affect the outcome too. So, um, and just reminding them, like these are the benefits of what we've put into place. A lot of your clients probably are going to be like, Oh yeah, you're right. I do love that convenience and I do love this. So of course I'll pay for it. And it's about, you know, noticing when you're doing that and resisting the urge. Like that's the easy way out discussing it in that way or saying, we spent 20 hours more on you this year. So that's why it's going up. That that's the easy way out. It makes sense for us. Nobody really cares about the hours that you work as an example. So it's all about, okay, how could we turn that communication around and frame it for the client in a way that makes sense for them? Exactly. Yeah. And the results that like, so instead of we'd put all this extra time, well, what was the actual result of all that extra time? There's gotta be something. Hopefully. And sometimes it is really hard to quantify those results and it's going to take a little extra energy and time to dig into each client to figure out what those are. But I'm sure there's something, and that's where Having a community or something of people to kind of brainstorm this type of stuff with is really good to bounce ideas. I mean, you could even bounce ideas off of chat GPT. You could. And I actually did develop what I call RyanBot now, Nice. which is I don't know if you saw, I don't know if I've, I don't think I've publicly said much about this at this point, but it's basically training it on how I communicate and how I would come up with templates to respond to certain situations. And so, yeah, I mean, there's a lot of, you could do this on chat GPT. You could do the, there's a, you know, you could do this on tax Twitter. You could do this on LinkedIn, variety of different communities out there. There's a lot of options to bounce ideas around back and forth. Yeah, absolutely. So speaking of communities, this is a good segue to talk about the community you have online Future Firm Accelerate. So this is, is it structured as a membership? At this point. Okay. Yeah, it's a membership. All right. So go ahead and talk a little bit about that in case anyone is interested and who it's for and all the wonderful people you have in there. So, basically, we're leading with the system. It's the system to systematize a firm allowing it to scale up to the desire you wish while helping you take a step back away from the business so that you can live a life of freedom. That's what we're trying to help firms do is help them live a life of freedom. So we lead with the system. it's supported by self paced training. So you follow these, these are the steps that you follow, supported by courses templates, all that kind of stuff, self paced. So you do it on your own time. And so, you know, step one of our system is, you know, get your pricing and packaging, right? So here's the templates to. Install better packages. Here's what you need to know about getting it right. You know, here's a thread in our community forums with hundreds of other firms. And what their packages look like and so we, we have the system supported by self paced training and then there's live coaching. So I host a monthly ask me anything call for any members that want to pick my brain whenever they're stuck in their business or need a sounding board. So there's a coaching component and there's also our community forums where members are collaborating online. They're sharing, you know, tips, tricks, best practices and various aspects of their, their firm. you know, we have other features as well, such as like, you know, we have our version of mastermind groups. which we call progress pods for people that want more support and accountability from their peers. And currently we have over 850 members from around the globe inside of the platform helping each other out at the moment. So it's really designed for, You know, we have firms in there that are just, just starting out and want to start with the right foundation. We have firms that are, I'd say sweet spot is like low to mid six figure range that are looking to get to the next level. We have firms at the seven figure range where the owner is like the bottleneck and you know, they're, they're dealing with a lot of overwork and they need to. You know, solve those kind of problems. We have eight figure firms as well, but those are certainly the minority. And it's really for people that just are looking for a more systematized version of their business so that they can step back and enjoy more freedom and flexibility with their family, with their friends and for their hobbies. Finally take some some real vacation time. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for providing a space for, for all these types of firms and doing the work that you do for our industry. We really appreciate it. Where can people find you to connect with you? So the, uh, the best place is probably following along on the newsletter, futurefirm. co slash newsletter. And you get my email addresses there as well. But that's my most popular piece of content is the newsletter itself. anyone listening that wants to, you know, consume some of the content, that's the best place to go. Awesome. Well, thank you, Ryan, for coming on the podcast. I Thank you very much, Tarina. I really do appreciate it. Yeah. Thank you so much. We'll talk to you soon.

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