The Ambitious Bookkeeper Podcast

168 ⎸ Slowing down to create more success with Katy Murray

• Serena Shoup, CPA • Episode 168

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In this interview episode, I’m chatting with Katy Murray, the brains behind the Gingerbiz Podcast. She’s a powerhouse who's done it all—from professional photography to managing HR for a big company, and even launching her own business, Katie & Co. We first connected through Threads, and it turns out we have a lot to chat about when it comes to finding success without burning out.

In this episode you’ll hear:

  • tips on slowing down to become more successful especially as a high-achiever
  • how to use social media intentionally
  • examples of morning and nighttime routines that encourage self-care
  • the importance of adjusting goals based on personal or family priorities


Resources mentioned in this episode:


Meet Katy

Katy Murray is a business owner, entrepreneur, Executive of Human Resources at a Private organization, mother, and wife. Receiving multiple awards and recognition for her Photography Talent, Katy's images have been featured in over 30 publications. Now, Co-Founder of 'Katy and Co, VA', Katy helps other businesses grow and meet their success. Katy has been a guest speaker at multiple Universities, on high-ranking Podcasts, and is the Host of her own Ginger Biz. On her podcast she shares all the tips and tricks to be successful in business, while also working full time, loving on her sweet family, and practicing self-care to maintain sanity. Katy is a fun-loving business guru who wants to share her passions with the world.


Connect with Katy



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Serena:

Welcome to the Ambitious Bookkeeper podcast. Today I am interviewing Katy Murray from, Gingerbiz, the podcast. And actually we both, , connected on threads, which has been a fun thing lately. So welcome, Katy. How are you?

Katy:

Thank you? so much. Yeah, threads have been a lot of fun.

Serena:

I signed up for threads when it first came out, but I was like, I can't right now. I, there's just too much. And so I just left it. And then maybe not even a month ago, I got back on there and I started just observing and the algorithm is like amazing right now and feeds you the things that you actually want to see. And, , there's no ads and stuff. So yeah, I just started seeing like really amazing posts from people I had never seen or heard of, especially around podcasting. I guess somehow I got into the podcast threads section and, there's so many connections that have happened from that of having people on my podcast and going on other people's podcasts that it's just like, it's kind of magic right now. So, this is really exciting.

Katy:

Yeah, I completely agree. I was the same way. It's like, I signed up but didn't utilize it because it was just too much. And now I'm like, this is fun. I just check in when I want to and meet people like you. So it's awesome.

Serena:

yeah. So I think you had posted on threads that you were wanting to go out on other people's podcasts and interview and, so I was like, Oh, I like her vibe. And like, I listened to your podcast and it just worked out. So, give everyone a background of like who you are and what you do and how you help people. And then we'll jump into our conversation, I guess.

Katy:

Yeah, absolutely. So, first and foremost, I'm like a wife and a mother. I have a toddler, and that is just its own thing. If you have children, you get it, because kids take up a lot of our time. But I'm also very, very business driven, and so I work full time. I'm the head of human resources in a private organization, um, where we have about 600 employees and about 7, 000 members in total. And so That's kind of what I do by day and I absolutely love my career and I'm not going anywhere but I also love my podcast which is all about entrepreneurs and career minded people and just giving lots of tangible tips and tricks for Anyone who's wanting to get into kind of the entrepreneurial world or start their own business. I started out as a professional photographer and I was featured in over 30 different publications, um, including People, Enterprise, A lot of really cool names that featured my images. And that's when I realized that it wasn't necessarily photography that I loved. It was the analytics of running a business and kind of learning how to make the sales and how to, you know, close in on the profit margin and make those things profitable while also doing something that I love. And so that's the quick version of my background. So I've been an entrepreneur for, Well over 14 years now, with that business. And then as I had my toddler, I kind of decided to step a little bit away from photography because I do work full time and my career has really grown so much that I'm Oftentimes staying a little bit later and stuff. And so I didn't want to be away on the weekends. And then we launched Katy and Co, which is Katy and company. It's me, my husband, and we have a couple of team members who help us. And we do virtual assisting, mostly social media management and Pinterest management, and just really helping with the marketing side of things for other businesses. yeah, so that's a little bit about me. I could go on and on cause there's a lot in there, but that's the quick version, the cliff notes, if you will.

Serena:

that is so awesome that's like so many different things. And so I can tell like you're an idea person, but that you also execute on those ideas. So I was really excited to have you on the podcast to talk about. various things. Originally, I was like, Oh yeah, HR, like I would love to have someone talk about HR on the podcast. And then it turns out that you do all these other things that are very applicable, you know, a lot of my listeners, a lot of us are moms and a lot of us still have careers. A lot of the people listening are working a full time job and maybe trying to start a side hustle doing bookkeeping or accounting work. And so I'm I felt like it would be really valuable to have you on and have a conversation about all of these things

Katy:

Mm hmm

Serena:

it and how you like choose ideas to pursue and which ones not to pursue and things like that. So I don't know where you want to dive in because I have so many questions.

Katy:

Well, you can either kick it off with questions., one thing that I will say is that it's, it's wild being, I think, a mom specifically, but just anybody, and being a high achiever, because that's something that, like, I'm prior military, I'm very, very proud of just everything that I've ever done, and I'm a high achiever, and I'm proud to be a mom. Mm hmm. Sometimes I just have to slow down. So I think that's a little bit what we can dive into today is just how to slow down when you do want to wear these multiple hats and you're not ready to hang any of them up because you love what you're doing on certain levels. Or like you said, some of, you know, your listenership might be wanting to kickstart their business and start to really maybe grow into that so they can step away from maybe their corporate jobs. And I think that it's important to know Where you have to pump the brakes in order to save up so you have that turbo later, if you will. Um and it's so important and that's coming from, recovering, if you will, perfectionist and a high achiever. And I've been told by many like, you got to take off your ambitious glasses and see the world like we do. And I was like, nah, I don't. And, and we can kind of like dive into that even because there's just so much around that. Of what you can do and what you can press pause on and where you need to push the turbo button and what you need to do to really get the most out of everything.

Serena:

Yeah, I, I think we should definitely start there, , given that this is the Ambitious Bookkeeper podcast. And, by the time this episode airs, I will have already released an episode where I talk about what it means to be ambitious and like how the brand has developed and stuff. But one of the things that you said was like kind of knowing, of embracing that, like, at least this is the way that I interpret it, right? Like being able to embrace the fact that you are a high achiever and ambitious, but also knowing when to like live in the season that you're in or pump the brakes in certain areas. and also like, know, I don't really identify as like a girl boss, like, there's those memes that go around that are like, oops, I girl bossed too hard and now I'm like super successful and it's like, I don't really, I don't hustle, but I am a high achiever. So, like, do you want to jam on that? Because I feel like you're pretty similar. Like, you don't come off as like a hustler, like you're going off and doing all these things 24 7, but you are. Achieving a lot in the time that you are working. So how do you, like, I don't know if you want to kind

Katy:

I, I love that because like I have, this is, this is something that I'm super passionate about. And so slowing down when you're a high achiever to be successful is so important. And one of the first points that I wanted to talk about, which you segwayed perfectly, is the cult of being busy. Like, I am not a hustler. I have moments of hustle. but The cult of being busy. Like, I don't believe in being busy. I want to be productive. So I'm not trying to be busy and just like boom, boom, boom, nailing everything out and just doing all these crazy things and just constantly on the go. I am lazy. Like I am the person who loves to curl up on the couch and like watch a movie or I take naps. Like I'm not, I don't identify either as like a girl boss. I definitely. Love my downtime. I love to unplug. I love to let my brain just not be. And, and so I think getting around kind of that hustle culture and that cult of being busy, that, that's such a dilemma. And I think probably a lot of your listeners can resonate with this. It's like, well, you're working full time and you're trying to build a side hustle and, and, and, and. So like, you don't have time to breathe, but that's where intentionality comes in. comes in and that's why it's so important to slow down because you have to think about where you want to put your time and how you basically like want to manage that so that you are growing in the right direction versus just throwing everything at the wall and hoping something sticks.

Serena:

Yeah. The intentional, the intentionality piece is so, so key. And I think that's where people look at, you know, look at someone that's really ambitious and a high achiever. And, and they think that. We're working all the time, but we're not. We're just really intentional during the times that we're working,

Katy:

Mm hmm.

Serena:

right?

Katy:

Absolutely.

Serena:

So

Katy:

And to say, just like with that, I've, I've gotten caught up in the hustle. I've gotten, even like in my day job, I'll be like, Oh my gosh, I have so much to get done today. Where do I even start? And then I just start like grasping at straws. And so one of the benefits of slowing down is to find that enhanced clarity and focus to say, Okay, I have like an overwhelming day ahead of me. And I'll use today as an example. You. Thankfully, we're very flexible with the scheduling of this. but I was at work all day. My husband, you know, Decided to point out that I had a 10 hour workday, and then I went into six hours of podcasting, So, You're at the end of that which is beautiful for me because I get to go home and go to bed after this, but Really slowing down for that enhanced clarity and focus to say hey What do I need to get done at work today so that I can go into these recordings and just like, you know, Breathe a little bit and just be intentional in that moment with where I'm at. And down lets you focus on that. And I tend to realize that when I start to get overwhelmed, and I start going to that hustle culture of like, I gotta work, I gotta work, I gotta do this, I gotta do this. Saying, whoa. What do I need to accomplish this week or this day or this hour to get me to where I want to be tomorrow? And really focusing on that improved creativity and innovation to build out from that. If you don't give yourself any space and you're stuck in this hustle mindset, you, you can't be creative. You don't have an idea for your next podcast episode or for your next client consult. Like you just don't have space for that because your brain is so involved if you will

Serena:

Mm hmm.

Katy:

and so I think that those are kind of two big ones is slowing down for that enhanced clarity and focus, and then also that improved creativity and innovation. And if you want, I can dive into those a little bit more, if that's helpful.

Serena:

Yeah, like what are some tactical ways of slowing down so that the listener is like, okay great. I need to slow down, but like what does that mean?

Katy:

Okay, thank you for asking because I am all about tangible takeaways. And so I love that. I would say I have like eight main tips and we don't have to get into all of them, but schedule downtime. I have the podcast. And last October, at the time of us recording this, it's, it's August. Last October, I was very intentional with my time. And so I scheduled a whole week where I wouldn't do anything after work. And then I scheduled a whole week where I could do podcast recordings. And I got to the point in October that all of my podcasts, I do a solo episode Tuesdays and a guest episode Thursdays. They I recorded and, produced and got them all ready through June. So

Serena:

Yeah.

Katy:

October, two episodes a week, October through June, I was able to knock out and be so intentional with what I did scheduling those guests and getting that done and still schedule downtime. So the first main point is look at your calendar and be like, I have a lot of crap to do, but I'm first going to block out certain days and blocking off periods of downtime in your schedule so that you can rest, so you can relax, so you can recharge, so you can just be. Whether it's like going for a walk or a quiet evening or reading a book or, or whatever, do that first because those are non negotiables. You need to schedule downtime. And then you can start filling in around that, like having a later night, like I'm on the East Coast time so it's later over here, and being intentional and being prepared and drinking an energy drink so I can stay up a little bit later and get this done. Mind you because I know that this weekend there's nothing on my schedule because I blocked it off.

Serena:

yeah, that's really important. I love, I, build things in constantly like that. Like I, I don't do meetings on Mondays or Fridays and I honestly try not to even work on Mondays and Fridays. Occasionally there's a season, right? Like, We're accountants. So at month end, the first, you know, it's actually usually the like second and third week of the month. I'll work a Monday to help get things out the door in time. But, other than that, like those are my personal days for rest and recharge and like my other Passion projects,

Katy:

I love that

Serena:

we can dive into too. Cause yeah. so yeah, I'm a huge proponent of like structuring your calendar that way. Like clients don't need access to you every single day. You're not their employee. Now, if you're an employee, that's different, but, if you're talking client work or, freelance type stuff, you get to decide your schedule. So.

Katy:

It's funny you say that because I, , recently brought on a couple new team members at my, job and I was working with the HR assistant and I was like, Fridays are like open because it, it got to a point where it wasn't. He was really trying to help, but he's like, Oh, a lot of people came in to see you today. So I put them all on Friday. And I was like, Oh my gosh, no, no. There's a reason that Friday is completely open and I'm here. I'm physically here working on Fridays, but I need some headspace to like catch administrative things or, you know, our HR department handles like the benefit enrollments and like all of those administrative tasks. And I'm like, I can't, Make sure that I'm putting 250 benefit enrollments in right if I am getting distracted by people always asking questions So I'm way I try to keep Fridays just like open because I need that space to be able to use my own brain versus letting other people like use it if that makes sense because they have bounce things off of me and stuff and It is a lot like you you did mention like My career versus my clients, but even with my clients, I will, and this is like a little off the cuff, but like I'll answer emails late at night, but I always schedule them for the next day because my clients don't get access to me at 9 PM. Like, a non negotiable. I have to set up boundaries. So even if I happen to have a burst of energy or the stinking energy drink kicks in way late, schedule them during normal business hours so that I'm cultivating a relationship with my clients that they know the culture of my business and that I'm not available and accessible at all times because I'm not a brain surgeon. I don't need to be.

Serena:

Yeah. I do the same exact thing., one of my team members showed me with an email that she received from someone else. I can't remember, what the context was, but she was like, check this out in her signature. She has like a little blurb that says, I. Maybe answering your, this email at an odd time, but that doesn't mean that you need to respond at the same time. This is just what time is best for me for working. And I was like, Oh, I like that, but I'm still going to schedule things during business hours.

Katy:

No, I love that. I actually had to do that with my boss today because I sent him like this long list just like updating him on stuff and he's like, I'm actually walking out to my car, like you must have just missed me and I was like, bro, you don't gotta respond to me. I was just able to get this out now and I'm proud of myself. like respond when you want. And I don't mean it like catty or anything, but this is my time and this is when I got it done. So when you get it, like when you're around, whatever, I don't care. So, you know. totally get that and it's important because I don't expect other people to work when I'm working or be off or be on when I'm on or off. It's, that's your prerogative and as long as the service that I need from you or what I'm paying for I guess is, done I don't care when it's done.

Serena:

Yeah, I agree. I'm very results driven and that's how we operate in my firm as well. The team picks their own hours. We meet once a week all as a team so that we get some face time. But other than that, I just like make sure that you're just hitting deadlines and ping me in Slack if you get stuck.

Katy:

Mm hmm. Mm

Serena:

I try to make myself available for the team like much all day. but there are times where I'm working at night and so are they. And things line up that way because

Katy:

hmm

Serena:

you know, they have kids too, and they're doing things on odd hours as well, so it works out.

Katy:

I love it when it like comes together like that.

Serena:

Yeah. what's another thing you said was scheduling and blocking off time to like rest and have open, empty space. What are, do you have like another couple that you could throw at us for ideas? Cause someone might be like, I know that already.

Katy:

You know they might know that, but they need to do it. They got to put it into action

Serena:

your reminder.

Katy:

I think like a couple of, um, are a little bit, no brainers, like practicing mindfulness and incorporating mindfulness practices into your daily routine. So whether that's, like for some people, that might be meditation or like prayer or like daily journaling or breath work. Those, You know, as, as silly as they might sound, I do think that they're important to really stay grounded, and know yourself. Like for me, I, talk therapy is my thing, it's my jam. So at my organization, I often times will go into the CFO's office and just unload on him. He is very like minded. We've done the DISC profile. Are you familiar with DISC at all?

Serena:

Vaguely.

Katy:

Okay So there's like the different quadrants or whatever, and I'm human resources and I am your friendly, happy go lucky, like ready to have a conversation can be super serious and empathetic. But one thing that surprises everybody is I'm actually a hard C, which is like I, my, dot I guess if you will, sits on top of the CFOs and the CFO is known for being. Well, I think that's kind of your audience. Like, you, you guys are analyticals and stuff, and so they're known for being, like, conscientious, and analytical, and reserved, and precise, and private, and systematic. And so it's so funny that I sit, like, right on top of his dot because I should be more in the influence or steadiness because of my role. And, uh, So with all that being said, I tend to need some talk therapy. And he relates and understands when I'm like, I don't like drive bys. I like appointments. I like structure. I don't like when people round up or round down, like that's not real. And so I often will go in there. And so for my mindfulness, I realized that going in and talking through an issue or a concern was super beneficial. So I actually have a journal that I keep at my desk at work. And so if I'm, struggling that day to like regain my focus or I'm lacking motivation and I have a long to do list, my mindfulness is just slowing down and recentering by honestly just like releasing that crap and so it's just throwing up on the pages and writing those words down. That's a big one for me. Another one would be setting realistic goals and that's kind of what I do in my journaling too. I, get out whatever's annoying me or whatever thought I have or whatever feelings it is and then I refocus with setting realistic goals. So instead of constantly chasing after bigger and better and more, I like to take the time to sit down and set realistic meaningful goals that align with my values and my priorities. Again, whether that's in work or in business, just focusing on the quality over the quantity. And then giving myself permission to just really pursue those goals with passion.

Serena:

I love that. I love that so much because for one, like, sometimes we do need to, well, we've kind of already talked about this, but like reel it in, like we can have really big goals, but sometimes it's not the right season to chase after them. And so you do have to like remind yourself about what your real values are

Katy:

Mm hmm

Serena:

season of life or whatever, right?

Katy:

absolutely

Serena:

I have to remind myself, like, my kids are still small, but they're not going to be small forever. So I can chase that other goal later.

Katy:

Oh man, that hits me, because like, exactly, and I've had to remind myself of that. Like, I, my daughter's four and I wasn't really, I mean like, I enjoyed her as a baby, but like, growing up I always thought babies were my thing, but I realized like, that's not the age that I relate with the most and my daughter is at a stage now where she can communicate and like she's sassy and she's fun and I realize like I want to soak that up so much like the other day she got out of bed and I was like what the heck why are you so tall like what happened to you why are you growing so much and I've been setting a lot of my like goals and passions a little bit to the side because I know that they'll still be there. I can still pursue business. I can still become a multi millionaire five years from now, but I snuggle my four year old five years from now. And so really putting that in perspective is so helpful. And even just you saying it is like, you're right. You're right.

Serena:

I say it out loud because I have to constantly remind myself too. And it's, you know, tricky, especially if you're, your business is the main source of income for your household like mine is, so it's like to a certain point, I do have to do certain things, but I don't have to grow it. much as I want to grow it right now.

Katy:

Yeah. There'll be time to scale and, you know, multiply. But as long as there's food on the table and things are getting done, today that's okay.

Serena:

I think that's more of a, a struggle for the high achievers that are like, I know I'm capable, especially when, you know, like, you know, the sky is the limit and you know, you're capable of so much when you get to a certain point and you've had results, you're like, Oh, I can just turn up this dial and like, I could do this. But now it's like. Going back to that intentionality thing,, like today I just had the realization of, right now I have a team that posts on social media, to like repurpose the podcast and all that kind of stuff. But all of the other social media content like stories and reels, I do those myself they're fun sometimes. Like I do find enjoyment in it. And so as long as it's I enjoy it, I'm going to keep doing it. But sometimes I'm like, I don't know if like, that's actually the best use of my time, but like, I do still want to grow. So the other option is to use ads. And I had this realization, I was like, I could probably completely stop posting organic reels and, stories on Instagram and just probably switch over to ads and then just have someone on the team manage ads and get better results growth. So it's like things like that that you have to consider. I'm like, okay, this is a time suck. Even though it's fun, it's not really like, adding that much value in the end. I don't know. It's a, it's interesting to like, to think through those things. obviously I have not completed the whole like thought process around it, but it was like a little realization that I had today.

Katy:

I think I'm at a similar place and I can relate to that because I too am like, I don't actually find a lot of joy in it. And so I find in like posting reels and stuff. However, I told myself like a week or two ago, so I'm in the same timeline as you that I was like, I don't have to post to social media like I do really want the podcast to gain traction and the affiliate links and like all that kind of like indirect money coming in and those other avenues. But I also don't want to feel like it's another job to manage social media when like that's not my sole income or that's not where my sole referrals come from. And so I tried to give myself a little bit of space. That's actually why I'm on threads because I was like, I don't want this to be picture perfect. I just want to have fun. I just want to talk to people and whatever. And it's funny because again, by slowing down and realizing that I have now posted more reels that just feel fun. than I was when I felt the pressure of it. And actually I was standing in the kitchen yesterday and I can like visualize where I was in that moment that I was like, yeah maybe I should just go the paid ads route and just be done versus all this extra work to like make this happen. And honestly, like what you're saying too kind of branches into like my next tip that I would give is like embracing imperfection. Like they don't have to be. perfect reels, or the perfect post, or the perfect recording. Like, it's okay to let go of the need to be perfect and just embrace the beauty of whatever it is you're doing and that imperfection. Because It's just too much sometimes, and like you said, like, we want to be with our kids, or we don't need to post to social in this moment, and it's gonna be there. Like, like you said when we started, like, threads is just another avenue that we have to, like, show up on to some degree. And that'll do it. That'll always be there. Like, and sometimes, let's be honest, the algorithm is like, whoa, this girl ghosted me for months and now she's back. Let me put her in front of everybody. And it works in our favor. So it really just depends. But I think leaning into that imperfection and just celebrating your progress and growth along the way. And just remember that, you know, success is linear. It's a journey. It's not the end result. We're just going to keep working for it, you know?

Serena:

Yeah. I've done a lot of thinking and redefining too of like what success is. and it, it's like different iterations throughout business as well. Like,

Katy:

Mm

Serena:

Even though the financial success is kind of important, like I said, when it's about putting food on the table, I value more having time. And so I'm, it's interesting how things shift. I'm like, I just want more time back in my day. So what can I cut that isn't, isn't

Katy:

Ha ha

Serena:

I was about to blend like two metaphors, driving the needle, moving the needle forward. I always mess those up, but you know what I'm saying like that's part of this whole conversation I guess is kind of also redefining what exactly your values and your, idea of success is. If the success is more money, then do the things that are going to bring in more money. If your success is more time with your family, then do the things that are going to give you more time with your family. So it could be hiring someone or, completely dropping something from your to do list, like social media. If it's not really that. Like for your, your example, if it's not the main driver of referrals and it's just something that's fun, not really a necessity.

Katy:

Yeah, not at all. And I think that sometimes we get caught up in whatever's trendy. And, I mean, I know I've fallen victim to this before. I've like seen a great business or whatever and then seen they have like, not very many followers or not very much engagement on Instagram. And I'm like, who am I to judge that? Like, I don't even have very many followers on Instagram. That's not the driving force for me. Like, LinkedIn is where I'm at and that's easy for me because I can schedule those and they go live and they hit the same as if they weren't scheduled, which is great. And so it just really depends on, yeah, where you're at in life and what makes the most sense to you in that moment and what's sustainable for that chapter almost, it could change. It could pivot. It could move and, you know, If that's okay, you know? Mm Mm hmm Mm

Serena:

I guess, A time in my business, like last, I don't know, last year, sometime where I was trying to be in all the places. And it's funny because I coach my bookkeepers of like choose one platform and just hang out there. Yes. You're, potentially missing out on customers that aren't on the platform that you're on, but choose the one that you enjoy the most and be on that and just focus all your efforts there, especially when you're just starting out. And since I've been in business now for like, seven years, I felt like it was time for me to actually like be in all the places because we post in all of them with a scheduler. So I was like, let me go and engage in all these places. so I was doing LinkedIn and I was, I don't really engage in Facebook, but I do run Facebook groups. So I do have to show up in those. And then I like being on Instagram. So I'm on that all the time. And then like. I just got to this point where, like midway through the year last year, I was just axing things off of my plate that just really driving things forward. And I haven't utilized LinkedIn like a lot of people have to like get clients and, and all that kind of stuff. I know that the opportunity exists there, but it, I wasn't getting any traction probably because I wasn't Really into it,

Katy:

hmm.

Serena:

And so that was one of the things that I completely dropped. I stopped, I didn't even check my LinkedIn for over six months until like recently. And I got back on there and was like, yep. Didn't miss a thing.. Mm-Hmm.

Katy:

That's funny. Yeah, that's, I mean, I dropped the Katy and Co. Instagram and just haven't done anything with it. And I'm like, cool, that's a bad look, but like, meh, it is what it is. Cause sometimes, you just like, spread yourself too thin and like, Then the next point that I was going to make was like limiting screen time and your interaction with the different platforms is similar to like mine with screen time as I got to a point where like I'm usually really intentional with my screen time and I will say that my husband kind of screwed me up on it because we switched over from using like a texting app to using the messenger app for all of our communications and so If, if you're listeners or you tune into like any of my episodes, I talk a lot about like time management and like boundaries and all these things. And so I have apps all blocked on my phone until 9 30 every morning so that I wasn't like distracted when I was getting ready and I could have intentional time before the day. But then I realized like a couple of days after we had switched into using messenger, I was like, my husband didn't tell me when he got to work or like he hasn't, reached out to me at all today. And we're pretty connected. Like, I mean, obviously there's times when I'm like, well, I'm recording for the next couple of hours or whatever. And he knows he's not going to hear from me, but generally speaking, we'll check in with each other. Cause we're both early risers. So we usually get to work pretty early, like seven 30. And so like by nine 30, I haven't heard from him. I'm like, what's going on. And I realized it's because I'm I have all those apps blocked on my phone. The only one that text messaging. And I realized I was like, Oh, well that doesn't make sense. So I started turning off, my screen limits, I guess, if you will. And so it's like called focus mode. I even hate to admit it, but like the boundaries around my use of technology now have completely like been screwed up because. I turned it off. And so now like I find myself aimlessly scrolling more and stuff like that. So for me, that was a huge time suck. And so I realized going back to designating specific times to when I can like be on my phone or be on social media and just implementing like almost a digital detox day or certain times to recharge gave me so much time back. And. I'm sure like you with LinkedIn by being like, Nope, I'm off of it for six months. You, you can re recalibrate that time to something else.

Serena:

Yeah. Which I totally did. I recalibrated that to like Instagram.

Katy:

Yeah. Hey, it works Mm

Serena:

but yeah, it's just, sometimes it just feels like a lot of noise, but yeah, it is really important to do a reset every so often because it does things start to creep in. It's like scope creep with clients, like your social media usage creeps back up. One thing I really like about threads and maybe Instagram has the same feature and I just need to turn it on. but yeah. I was playing around with the threads settings just like poking around one day and it was like, oh, you can set like a screen limit on it. And

Katy:

hmm

Serena:

have it to where after 15 minutes or maybe it's 10, straight minutes of being on threads, this little thing pops up and like it blanks out the screen. It's like, you've been on threads for so long. Do you want to like take some downtime or like ignore? And so usually I, that's, I, I just closed the app at that point. I'm like, all right, my time's up.

Katy:

Hey, that's good self discipline. Cause I'm like the type that's like, Whoa, I mean, I told you to tell me this, but why are you telling me this? Leave me alone.

Serena:

Yeah, sometimes I do ignore it, but lately I'm like, I know I've slipped into the too much screen time, so I'm gonna allow that boundary because it is really easy to go down the rabbit hole on threads.

Katy:

Oh man, it totally is. Especially with like, I mean look at this, like this is how we met. So I'm like, look at this. Threads is amazing. Like, on it. Let me make these connections and I'm like, Just kidding. And I, I have the same thing for bedtime. I have a bedtime routine on my phone until it kicks in but I, opposite of you, I have not used my self discipline at all. I'm like, don't tell me how to live my life and I hit pause. And then I just like keep being on my phone and I Again, super vulnerable, but I need to like, recalibrate there because it's a time suck and honestly, it takes away from just like, savoring simple pleasures, if you will, like watching a movie with my husband at the end of the night, or I think it was last week or the week before I like put my phone away and we played cards and just like rummy or whatever, super simple, but it just gave us like a time to chat that I would have missed out on if I was still sucked into my phone and I think that for me personally that's something that I need to like get better at because I used to never hardly be on apps. I have very set times when I check my emails, very set times when I check socials, very set times when I post. So that's another big one but then also for slowing down and like a practical tip is savoring simple pleasures like Take time to just slow down and fully appreciate the simple pleasures in life. And that could be enjoying a cup of tea in the morning or savoring a good meal with loved ones or watching the sunset or cultivating mindfulness because that as business owners is going to, and don't do it just because of this, but that is going to give you space to find some innovation and some creativity. Because like, have you, ever experiences or had a friend who's like, oh my gosh, I thought of the best idea in the shower.

Serena:

hmm. That's me.

Katy:

Okay, and that, to me, like, I love that. I'm a total shower girl. I take way too long. But what I'm finding is, and I think a lot of people can relate to this, there's nothing pulling our attention. Like, maybe our children, but my daughter's old enough now that I'm like, mommy's taking a shower. Like, they're like, Let me be or sometimes I'll give her my phone which is probably equally as bad, but with that It's that slowing down and giving ourselves space to just have thoughts because I feel like we're so engaged like we're either interacting with our children or we're interacting with our clients or working on some project that we did get out or like for you working with numbers and the team and all these things that by slowing down and just enjoying the cup of coffee or sitting on the porch after dark and watching fireflies, just let your brain have some space that it's not. Getting stuff thrown into it at the same level.

Serena:

My thing is Definitely the shower, but also every morning, I make my coffee and I sit on my porch and like, I got myself some new patio furniture so I could enjoy it even more. Cause I'm like, you know what? This is my thing. It's part of

Katy:

Mm hmm Mm

Serena:

sure it's comfortable and enjoyable. So yeah, I do my coffee. I sit on the porch and I try to read a book. sometimes I do A little bit of scrolling, but I'm trying to get back to like, again, like

Katy:

hmm

Serena:

whole reset thing this morning, I, I left my phone on the charger. I didn't even unplug it until, after I had sat on the porch and read for like 15 minutes, I was like, okay, I did my whole morning routine, did my coffee, left the phone on the charger until all of that was done. And it felt a lot better. Like just the way that it sets your day up is completely different. and yeah, I had all sorts of like ideas even after a lot of times I'll get ideas while I'm reading because like a word will like pop out at me and I'll be like, ooh, partly because like I write music. And so lot of times, like when I'm reading, I get song prompts, basically, from whatever I'm reading, whether it's the subject or even just like a phrase or a word. I'll be like, oh my gosh, I need to, I could totally write a song around this whole topic or use that line in a song. And so I even get ideas when I'm reading novels.

Katy:

Hey, I love it! Wherever like, your inspiration is, is important, and again, it, a lot of it probably stems from, like, slowing down and, like, consuming something that's, like, you probably don't even know it, but, like, motivational. Like, something that you're just giving yourself space for. I that you know, it's funny, too, because, you know, Again, I just feel like we're on the same wavelength because that would be my number seven would be establishing rituals and routines. And you just spoke to yours and it's, you know, as the listener, it might seem trivial to be like, well, I don't need a morning routine or a night routine, but something that, you know, sets that the pace of your day impactful. You're going to start your day off on a better foot if you slow down and like you do Serena, like read your book or. sit and just enjoy your coffee and be in nature, whatever it is for, for the individual, morning meditation practice or an evening wind down routine or some sort of self care throughout the week. I think just having that consistency and almost sense of stability and grounding amidst like the busyness of life can really help you recenter, refocus, and just get in the right headspace. to be intentional and kind of, if you will, like everything we've talked about up until this point on this episode, like those things are going to help sustain all of that in the best of ways.

Serena:

Yeah. I, I'm a huge, I love routine and a lot of that is Um, just from being a mom, like, we know that that helps our children. So it's like, then you get to where you're like, Oh, okay, actually, the route, the bedtime routine is also really good for me to do for myself as my nighttime ritual to wind down and like, signal to the body that it's time to like, slow down. And especially again, like, as you and I are talking about being high achievers, like, it's a really good tactic to turn off your brain and get yourself used to like having a nighttime routine. I do, like my whole skincare routine and my brush my teeth and all that. And then I usually listen to like a guided meditation as I'm laying down to sleep. Otherwise I can't turn my brain off.

Katy:

Yeah, I think that's common for us high achievers, like we're just constantly going, like the other night I woke up in the night and I couldn't fall back asleep and I was like, Katy, please stop thinking. Please just stop. And then I like Because I can't count sheep because I have to get to a certain number. And like, there's just I can't do because I'm so, like, I do think that I would be like a good accountant or bookkeeper because I'm very analytical in my approach to things. But then there's certain like, there's just certain things I can't do. Like, people are like, well, just think about this or think about that. And I'm like, okay, I'll think about five things and then I'll go to sleep. And I'm like, wait, no, I don't. That's not how this works. Like, it's a whole But For me too, another big one is like, simplifying my environment. I didn't realize, like, until later in life, how like, simplistic things help me. like having like any clutter or accessible longings. Because they really contribute to like, a sense of overwhelm and busyness for me. And Okay, good. Cause I was like, hopefully this will make sense. But yeah, that's a big one for me. So like, oftentimes I would find myself when, again, like you're a mom. So you get this one. I had like a time when I was at home and. Like my husband would take the baby or something. I would first like clean up the house and then, you know, it's not like he was gone for very long. So then I'd like lose out on time to do other things. And I couldn't figure out like what my problem was. And I started to realize that I needed to like decolor and simplify my physical environment by getting rid of just like unnecessary unnecessary, items, or having a clean space or organized space so that I could have almost a sense of calm and clarity for myself. And that was like a really. big one that made a big impact. And so like we talked about earlier with time management, we hired a house cleaner because number one, I'm a little bit of a germaphobe, not totally, but a little bit. So having my toddler like come around and try to clean the toilets with me just killed me inside. And ended up having to like take a shower every time afterwards. And so it just made more work. So I decided, you know what? I can. pay another small business to come and clean my home and do what they're good at. They can do it 10 times faster than I can. And I can use that time to put back on a certain week into my business or back into my kid or back into like gymnastics or whatever the case is.

Serena:

Yeah.

Katy:

if anyone's on the fence for that sort of thing, I am a huge believer in like the cost of doing business and setting aside, like thinking about all your numbers. And for me as a photographer or as a VA, My hourly rate was, not to sound like, humble brag, was far more than what the cleaner's charging me. I could just get an extra hour of work in or service an extra hour for a client, it paid for itself in abundance. And so, for me, that was a big one. And so just simplifying my environment and having a clean space allows me to really focus on my work. Almost like the tranquility of it and then making it so much easier to slow down and focus on what matters versus feeling overwhelmed looking at my living space and not being able to kind of like Separate my living space from the chaos in my mind if that makes sense. that's another big one

Serena:

totally relate to that. I did the same thing. and that was one of the first, that was actually a threads that I answered today. Someone had posted a question, like I'm getting to a point where I'm like at capacity in my business. I don't know what to outsource first. And I, Like basically gave my advice. Like the first thing I outsourced when I only had like five clients was the more basic level tasks that I was doing every month for clients that I could easily teach to someone else and create a process around. And like I hired that out. And then the next thing was stuff in the home because that bought back my time. Then I was able to, increase my capacity with work. and then it not only buys back time, but it, buys your sense of peace and calm, and so you're more productive while you're working because you're not thinking about the dishes and the sink or your baseboards being dusty that you're looking at while you're in your office or whatever, you know, so it's totally worth it. Definitely highly recommend.

Katy:

I love that we, we're similar. Like we, I started investing in like a CRM platform and like automating and systemizing everything. And that was able to alleviate enough for me to start. And then honestly, one big mistake is I should have, I guess, hired help if you will, like much earlier when it comes to the business. Because, you know, I'd been in it for over a decade and then I was like, okay, let's hire a team member. But even just the simplicity of like having a CRM platform to do all this in and utilizing templates and like workflows was beautiful. And then yeah, at first I felt kind of bad as a mom for hiring like a house cleaner, but then I was like, why? I don't enjoy doing it and I'm not good. I do to some level actually enjoy cleaning because I do like having a clean space and like, The accomplishment of it, but yeah, and then we got two dogs and so that just pushed me over the edge.

Serena:

Yeah, oh yeah. you introduce animals, yeah, definitely hire a cleaner.

Katy:

Yeah, it's just not worth the fuzz balls

Serena:

too. The other thing too is like, my routine for cleaning, when I'm the one that's cleaning, I don't clean the whole entire house top to bottom. I haven't been able to do that since birth. before kids. So it's also like not ever rewarding because it immediately like it's one room at a time over the course of a week. And then by the time you finish the whole house, you're starting all over again.

Katy:

Yeah, that's a total valid, like totally valid point because I remember one time I, my mom grew up where like she had winter clothes and summer clothes. And I mean, she had five kids and so I, it makes sense now that like you couldn't keep all the clothes in the closet at the same time, I guess. I don't know. And so I like kind of took that on when my daughter was born. And then as she got older, she'd like pull it out before I even finished folding half of it. And I was like, this is so obnoxious. so quickly realized that's not worth it. Similarly to like cleaning, like you just, you can't keep up and I'm not the only one making the mess anymore. So it's a whole thing. But you just find what works. I mean, we also outsource grocery shopping. Like, I mean, we grocery shop, but it's delivered. So we're not going to store anymore. And it costs me 3. 95 to have it delivered. And then I tip. So that is definitely worth the hour and a half it saves me or however long. So you figure out what works for you in your chapter of life. And, you know, maybe I'll. Start cleaning my own house again when my child's older? Probably not though. but I might start going back to the grocery store at some point. Who knows?

Serena:

Yeah. I I do both. I do have groceries delivered, but sometimes I like to go to the store and see the produce and pick it out myself. But like, I know that if I'm in a pinch, like, I'll just reorder the last grocery order we had so that there's food in the house if I'm too busy to go to the store and it, and it happens

Katy:

Yeah

Serena:

And yeah, that's a really good one too. I didn't use to have that luxury because I lived too far out of town. So,

Katy:

imagine. We're like, basically in Washington, D. C. So we're totally in a city. But I've like had things delivered when we're like Airbnbing or whatever and I'm like, or tried to, and they're like, we don't deliver there. I'm like, what? What do you there? That's, that's mind boggling. Like you, did I mistype the address? Like I don't understand. I forget. Some people still don't have that, which is crazy.

Serena:

Yeah, my heart goes out to you, if that's you, because I know what it's like. Um, okay. So yeah, this has been a really awesome conversation. and I hope that, like, since it's, it's really late for you, I don't want to keep you any longer, but I hope that this conversation was valuable to anyone listening. If someone wants to connect with you, they should connect with you on threads, but if not threads, where's the next best place?

Katy:

Yes, this has been such a fun conversation. So, Instagram is always a good place. I'm at Gingerbiz, G I N G E R B I Z. or my website, which is www. K A T Y M U R R A Y photography. com. So Katy Marie photography. Those are both great spots. yeah. And of course threads, which is the same Gingerbiz, It's definitely been a lot of fun chatting. I love talking with other high achievers because you just vibe, you just get it, you understand kind of that relentless pursuit of success and how important it is to slow down and really just enjoy the journey. So thank you so much for having me on and having this conversation. It's been fun.

Serena:

Yeah. Thank you so much. And I'm going to plug your podcast one more time. So our listeners are on the podcast platform now, so you can just look up Gingerbiz the podcast and listen to Katy's podcast as well. Thank you so much for coming on here, Katy. I super appreciate it. I'm glad we connected I'll see you on threads.

Katy:

Yeah, thank you.

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